Are they starting to make Olivia too perfect and superwoman?

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Re: Are they starting to make Olivia too perfect and superwo

Postby myrtus on Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:20 am

shirtlessfrank wrote:It's a science fiction show.

Super powers are par for the course.

I agree with this and, really, Olivia being a Mary Sue wasn't even the OP's main issue, just her superpowers. My question is, why is it an issue now, when her superpowers were established in S1? It's not like she has developed new ones since then, as far as I know.

DarthLocke said earlier, that :

perfection is not an absolute, it's an "IDEAL" of what one person looks for, or expects in life of people, places, things.

While this is true, the term Mary Sue is not meant to describe perfection. AroundMyFinger12's post above pretty much clarifies, what it is. Being a Mary Sue doesn't imply, that the character doesn't have flaws, but those are meant to be endearing or to elicit compassion for the character, instead of dislike. In Olivia's case, her only flaws are: she can be cold and distant (except with children :roll: ) and she has trust issues. Even those flaws are the consequence of all the abuse she suffered as a child, which elicits compassion more than anything. Besides that... not much, really. Her moral standards are high, she's forever generous and selfless, she's highly intelligent, competent, multi-talented, etc.


Perfect description of how Olivia is a Mary sue, a very unlikable Mary Sue.

Unlikable to you. The reason most main characters on TV are Mary Sueish or Marty Stuish is, because people like them, otherwise they would have ceased to exist long ago. Writers seem to have more liberty writing real flaws, as in unlikable, or darker flaws with the rest of the characters, but the main one is usually untouchable.

Take for example a show like Battlestar Galactica. Every single main character was more or less realistic within the context of the show. Every single one had huge realistic character flaws. The result? Lots of complaints, because it was so difficult to root for the heroes.
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Re: Are they starting to make Olivia too perfect and superwo

Postby DarthLocke on Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:43 pm

^ Agreed.

Although [not] me, some people might find her lack of social discourse in her personal life a flaw. She has a hard time just being friends, or friendly with people, because she is so serious. So one might argue that her sense of justice is an extreme trait which 'holds' herself back from being 'everything' she "could" be. However like I was saying, any trait can be good or bad, a flaw or a strength in any given situation, because although there is an argument to made about what I just said, one can also say that her restraint is a plus because she has self control, making her decisions less irrational and more pro-universal (<---utilitarian-for the good of many). But again this also has to do with the philosophical understanding of the viewer and their own belief system/or acceptance of other philosophies while watching the show....and then the writers goal for the character in relation to the plot. Olivia was a sleeper agent trained to be a soldier so she could protect her universe, or universes. So I would think it important and sensible that she has Mary Sue qualities for this goal since she is cast as the lead actress.

Personally I see Mary Sue's more in lititure, than on TV or Film. So Actually I find having a strong dedicated female character refreshing. And like you were saying, she doesn't always make the right decisions --she occasionally lashes out, because she bottles up her emotions.

Yet for all their evolution, they form no bonds.
Love does not exist for them. They are incapable of dreaming,
Of contemplating beauty, Of knowing something greater than themselves.
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Re: Are they starting to make Olivia too perfect and superwo

Postby supermodel on Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:43 am

Every time a write a post in one of these threads I think better of it and delete it.

Aroundmyfinger, I think maybe you just don't like Fringe. Would you even watch it if Joshua Jackson was not in it? Because it seems like you don't enjoy any part of the show other than seeing him onscreen. Perhaps you are forcing yourself to watch a show that just isn't your thing.
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