Season 4! Call it!

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Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Tue May 17, 2011 6:04 pm

Hey guys! Now that we have had a little time to sit with the finale and have heard some explanations from showrunners and producers, I thought starting now would be a good time for us to begin our thoughts for some things we think Season 4 might entail.

I myself am going to start with Peter (or Peters)...I am in the process of putting something together, so I will be back on either later today or sometime tomorrow with those thoughts.

But what about you guys? Peter, the machine, the Observers??? What do think is going to happen or be revealed about them in season 4? Or what would you like to see happen? :)
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby Woongo on Thu May 19, 2011 2:37 pm

I think we will get to see how Walter brings the machine back in time. Maybe even a glimpse of dinosaurs! :D
I'd also love to see a new universe. Maybe a new threat for both universes!
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Thu May 19, 2011 5:48 pm

Peter:

The finale shows viewers a "possible 2026", which then via course correction and cassimar effect simultaneously gives us an idea of how another timeline caused at least the blue universe to exist, as the blue universe was the previous universe that has been altered by time travel via black hole to the paleolithic period, and introducing technology and people (variables) where they had yet to exist in the previous timeline.

With that I feel this possible 2026, although temporary--it hasn't come to pass, gives hints at not only the past, but also things that we might start playing with in the now newly altered converged 2011 timeline(s).

DECEMBER: You were right. They don't remember Peter.
THE OBSERVER: How could they? He never existed. He served his purpose.


This line is most important line to the finale's ending, because we have to ask ourselves what do the Observers mean here? December implies that is MEMORY -that has been changed. I have often said in many posts that MEMORY is the key to our reality, because how any of us know ourselves and each other, as we are, in space-time has everything to do with how we remember the history of it. This is what relativity is for humanity. You relate to me in "this way" because this is what I have come to know and believe to be true about this relationship.

September then takes it a step further and implies that it is that [Red} Peter never existed. [Red} Peter served his purpose...

The catch 22's.

When we go back and watch "White Tulip" we learn that the blue universe timeline has had attempts to be altered already by A. Peck. His resets show us similar variations, but no variation is exactly the same, and in the end he ends up not existing in the timeline, as in the final alteration, he dies with Arlette....However he left behind the white tulip for Walter to have...but because of the resets, the timeline is altered and Walter nor anyone else, but the viewers, knows how Walter comes to receive the tulip and why, because each reset also resets everyones, but the time traveler, Peck's, memory....

This is what the machine allows Peter to do. It allows him to see possible futures, ones that are considered currently probable to the 2011 red and blue timelines, in which he get's information that allows him to make a decision that enables him to reset the timeline at the 2011 mark. So for whatever reason he decided to change his existence, or really "the way he existed", to the the timeline...

What's curious is that 2026 timeline introduces that the machine and the first people came from another 2026 in which other versions of themselves are relative to the first people and the creation of the machine, and being involved in traveling with it in time...

This leaves us with the unknowing fates of those previous reality characters...including then another Peter.

In addition going back to "the many alterations" of A. Peck, we might also have to ask ourselves could have any of the 3 possible Peters ALREADY used the machine in blue universe timeline?

I think it's very possible. I think it would explain some things that don't make physical or even storyline sense...things like Walter's birthday being over a year later after Robert has died, Having Newton be different than all other models of shapeshifters, knowing that there was another Shapeshifter that Peter never found that had more info he needed, ect.

The blue characters have been the only characters the writers have chosen to play with MEMORY with. From the Pilot with blue Olivia sharing John's conscience, in which later her memories start to blur with his and as he astral projects to prove himself to her, to the cortexifaners being sleeper agents and loosing memories, or William Bell cutting out parts of Walter's brain causing him to forget things, to hints of Peter being conditioned and experimented on as a kid, to Olivia being subjected to the red Olivia's memories and life, and then William Bell sharing her body, in which Walter and Peter also must share conscience with her to try and save her life!

IMO this tells us point blank that the blue universe is more mutable than other universes and it is the key in being able to change. In addition the blue Olivia and blue Walter are also more redemtive and reflective, and it is through them that Peter comes to believe in a better universe with a better fate...which through him changes the attitudes and actual states of being (physical and emotional) of the red Olivia, and hopefully in time Walternate.

The 2026 reality also showed us that the war really shouldn't be between the red and blue reality, but extreme terrorists who want to us certain technology to "start over from the beginning), which is what we were dealing with back in season 1--->ZFT = End of Dayers. (ZFT-Corrupt terrorists and members of the government/technology cmpanies using technology to create holes --->David Robert Jones, Dr. Winters, Stanford Harris)

Back to John Scott

Walter argued constantly that John Scott shouldn't be able to interact with Olivia they way he was, while she was in the tank...but later it was revealed that John's body was being kept preserved in an incubator via Massive Dynamics. We could conclude that the reason all of that could happen was because John was in some way still alive and so his conscience remained currently active.

When blue Olivia gets left behind in the red universe and subjected to Red Olivia's memories, she suddenly reaches a plateau and starts to see Peter.

Most fans took this as a hilusination, I however thought that like with John Scott there had to be some kind of physical reason he could appear in a similar manner as John Scott. So I kept expecting a reveal that Peter and Olivia must have shared conscience in the past...but full proof of that has yet to be revealed, however Peter does eventually share conscience with her in "LSD". In "LSD" Peter, like John, proves himself to Olivia. There are parallels with in "LSD", "The Transformation", and "The Day We Died". A Christmas tree appears in the home of young Olivia and "christmas" was the code word Olivia was to use to take down terrorist, Conrad Monreau. At The end of "LSD" we come to see a man marked with an "X" who supposibly may be responsible for killing Olivia...in the finale we see 2026 Walternate and a head Terrorist Walternate aligns himself with Moreau is associated with 2026 blue Olivia's death.

If we take simulation hypothesis/course correction as the reason for all reoccurrances and repeats, then we might conclude that at some time some version of Peter and Olivia did share conscience and now they have again--but emphising once more that the blue universe does not have to have "proper" event order to exist. Another example is in "Subject 13". White tulips are able to grow in a time of year and place where they initially could, or should not.

Going back to the 2026 for hints, the writers went out of their way to show Walternate being able to astral project himself (digital avatar?) in front of Peter in their old house, while in fact he physically was somewhere else.

My thoughts:

I think the one hidden machine may preserve "Peter", but I could see sanrios where "which Peter" is the one that is being preserved and/or could be returned to us might be a hard thing to predict.

At any rate I could see that either we will get a Peter that exists, but has different set of memories than red Peter had....in which perhaps red Olivia still has a child because she either went to sperm bank, the prophecy of Peter left some Peter DNA behind with specific instructions (Think Milo Rambaldi), and Peter is an orphan who can not find any information on his parents (because it no longer exists) and he donated some sperm for money, or something like that. Or perhaps not at all.

It could be that if the machine has been used by other versions of Peter in the blue universe timeline, that the two machines together could let one Peter get in and essentually another one gets out (replaced)...

But I would really love for this to be taken a step further. That his body/bodies are preserved inside the machine....and that an astral projected Peter would also exist. Either the same red Peter as we knew, or a Super Peter with lots of variations of Peters' memories built in (Think John Locke--->MIB/Smoke Monster). Which this also could be Observer-esque.

Another reason I think it could go that way is because as part of the extras FOX site gives to Sprint Costumers about things happening in another universe, there was one document in with DARPA reveals that an invisibility cloak has been stolen...This is a blatant reference to Harry Potter, and like with Star Trek references (The Road Not Taken) does The Deathly Hallows and The Wrath of Khan/Search For Spock play with plots of "soul transferences" in order to achieve life extension/immortality. Even Peter's sudden non existence reminded me of the deluminator. It would be a way for Peter to cheat the timeline and death, but yet still play a role.
Last edited by DarthLocke on Fri May 20, 2011 1:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby real1 on Thu May 19, 2011 8:20 pm

It's happening again .. that i wrote a long post and then disappear :cursing:

Need some time to recovery

:cool:
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Fri May 20, 2011 1:57 am

real1 wrote:It's happening again .. that i wrote a long post and then disappear :cursing:

Need some time to recovery

:cool:


Oh No! :scared: I hate when that happens :cursing: ....sometime I write it on word or note pad and save it first and then I transfer it over... :cyclops:

Woongo wrote:I think we will get to see how Walter brings the machine back in time. Maybe even a glimpse of dinosaurs! :D
I'd also love to see a new universe. Maybe a new threat for both universes!


I do hope we see other times (or universes) and get more specifics of who was involved with what concerning the first people and the terrorists (or what ever specific reason they will give for why they were trying to hide the machine in time).

Hhhhmmm Dinosaurs! :thumbsup:
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby myrtus on Fri May 20, 2011 8:31 am

Interesting post DarthLocke :)

DarthLocke wrote:When we go back and watch "White Tulip" we learn that the blue universe timeline has had attempts to be altered already by A. Peck. His resets show us similar variations, but no variation is exactly the same, and in the end he ends up not existing in the timeline, as in the final alteration, he dies with Arlette....However he left behind the white tulip for Walter to have...but because of the resets, the timeline is altered and Walter nor anyone else, but the viewers, knows how Walter comes to receive the tulip and why, because each reset also resets everyones, but the time traveler, Peck's, memory....

And yet I cannot compare Peter's case to A. Peck, because Peck only altered the timeline, from the point he made a different choice onwards. So Walter didn't get to interact with him, but Carol Bryce and that professor at the end remembered him. It's not only the audience, who know about Alastair.

Not so in Peter's case. Every single event of Peter's history was erased, even his own birth. He simply never existed.

This is what the machine allows Peter to do. It allows him to see possible futures, ones that are considered currently probable to the 2011 red and blue timelines, in which he get's information that allows him to make a decision that enables him to reset the timeline at the 2011 mark. So for whatever reason he decided to change his existence, or really "the way he existed", to the the timeline...

I don't know if this is true. He was talking and then he disappeared in mid-sentence. He didn't behave like he knew he would disappear.

IMO this tells us point blank that the blue universe is more mutable than other universes and it is the key in being able to change. In addition the blue Olivia and blue Walter are also more redemtive and reflective, and it is through them that Peter comes to believe in a better universe with a better fate...which through him changes the attitudes and actual states of being (physical and emotional) of the red Olivia, and hopefully in time Walternate.

That's not exactly correct. It was through blue Elizabeth, that Peter acquired that philosophy, as shown in "Subject 13". Maybe even through his real mother, too, but we don't know that. See, for instance, Peter's optimism in 2026 against Olivia's doom and gloom attitude, when they were talking about having a family. I'm not saying Olivia was wrong, but she didn't expect things to get better, while Peter still retained his "if you can dream a better world, you can make a better world" philosophy.

I cannot predict anything about Peter, because he's been so utterly, and apparently irreversibly, deleted from the show. I know Joshua Jackson will be back, but we don't know if they'll keep his screentime to that of a guest star or what his role will be. Josh could play a completely different character with a different name with no connection to the main characters for all I know.

I think that S4 will be about the red and blue Fringe teams (minus Peter) solving cases and occasionally crossing over. :unsure:
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Fri May 20, 2011 2:30 pm

myrtus wrote:Interesting post DarthLocke :)

DarthLocke wrote:When we go back and watch "White Tulip" we learn that the blue universe timeline has had attempts to be altered already by A. Peck. His resets show us similar variations, but no variation is exactly the same, and in the end he ends up not existing in the timeline, as in the final alteration, he dies with Arlette....However he left behind the white tulip for Walter to have...but because of the resets, the timeline is altered and Walter nor anyone else, but the viewers, knows how Walter comes to receive the tulip and why, because each reset also resets everyones, but the time traveler, Peck's, memory....

And yet I cannot compare Peter's case to A. Peck, because Peck only altered the timeline, from the point he made a different choice onwards. So Walter didn't get to interact with him, but Carol Bryce and that professor at the end remembered him. It's not only the audience, who know about Alastair.

Not so in Peter's case. Every single event of Peter's history was erased, even his own birth. He simply never existed.

This is what the machine allows Peter to do. It allows him to see possible futures, ones that are considered currently probable to the 2011 red and blue timelines, in which he get's information that allows him to make a decision that enables him to reset the timeline at the 2011 mark. So for whatever reason he decided to change his existence, or really "the way he existed", to the the timeline...

I don't know if this is true. He was talking and then he disappeared in mid-sentence. He didn't behave like he knew he would disappear.

IMO this tells us point blank that the blue universe is more mutable than other universes and it is the key in being able to change. In addition the blue Olivia and blue Walter are also more redemtive and reflective, and it is through them that Peter comes to believe in a better universe with a better fate...which through him changes the attitudes and actual states of being (physical and emotional) of the red Olivia, and hopefully in time Walternate.

That's not exactly correct. It was through blue Elizabeth, that Peter acquired that philosophy, as shown in "Subject 13". Maybe even through his real mother, too, but we don't know that. See, for instance, Peter's optimism in 2026 against Olivia's doom and gloom attitude, when they were talking about having a family. I'm not saying Olivia was wrong, but she didn't expect things to get better, while Peter still retained his "if you can dream a better world, you can make a better world" philosophy.

I cannot predict anything about Peter, because he's been so utterly, and apparently irreversibly, deleted from the show. I know Joshua Jackson will be back, but we don't know if they'll keep his screentime to that of a guest star or what his role will be. Josh could play a completely different character with a different name with no connection to the main characters for all I know.

I think that S4 will be about the red and blue Fringe teams (minus Peter) solving cases and occasionally crossing over. :unsure:



If you watch the road not taken then you realize to come to understand that at every single point in life can a new reality branch off and be considered "alternate" from any other. Peter's case is not exactly like Peck's because Peter used forward knowladge and then turned around and used it to make a decision (which the writers explain in their video that this is what Peter's ability is), but in both cases the timelines are altered and reset. What I mean tby memory of Alestor Peck, was that no one remembered him "the way he was" in the previous alterations(like I was also making point of--no else knew what Peck had done, or was doing, every time he resets that "exact" reality gets replaced by a new one (which in Peck's was similar, but eventually different)...I did not mean that he didn't exist, but that everything he did in other alterations is LOST (memory loss), except for passing along the tulip, which Walter now thinks is a sign of God, and not just from a man he just previously had a conversation with, because that timeline has been altered. Peck could alter the timeline greatly even in such a small period of time, because he himself died, where as he didn't before thus changing his existence and relativity to the future of the timeline. Peter's machine is like this, except LARGER scaled...he has just altered the timelines and converged them by not existing, regardless of what he knows, will, know, or doesn't know..it has been changed. "White Tulip" proves to viewers that things can come to be with out anyone knowing (remembering) how. That alterations could have been happening in regards to other things that don't make sense to what we think should be true. This IMo is also why they used white tulips again in "Subject 13" -this memory Peter and Olivia have is lost, they do not remember because they have been 'programmed' to not remember (Nick Lane -Bad Dreams, Walter- LSD, In Which we Meet Mr. Jones/Dream Logic = Peter shocked with car battery/conditioned to not remember his dream), but then also the tulips grow in a place where they never have or thought could be before, as Olivia can also make make it snow in Florida --The blue represents water --and thoughts/fluid imagination---> "dreams," because "If we can DREAM a better world, we can MAKE a better world." --Peter. In every sense this is truth, because the way in which humanity exists and learns is about what we believe in our minds to be possible...other wise we wouldn't fly in planes, drive in cars, and the world would still be flat. Innovation and change comes one's belief in being able to do so. -Which should be truth as "change" is the constant of life.

I am sure it will start off with blue and red with a new enemy, which is also what 2026 reveals. --But I do think we have many options for Peter, or Peters since IMo White Tulip offers the possibility of multiple alterations that maybe we didn't know already exist. And I still think Peter's mirror to John Scott should also not be passed over.


My arguement about a better fate is epmerical. Since both universes must derive to exist because there is a universe , a parent, in which the machine comes from, then in a way each universe represents one half of that universe. The red characters are solid in terms of their identites. They do not experience things that change their memory/perception directly....for them it takes a lot to change, or even think that they should change.

Peter has grown up amoungst the blue so he is infuenced by them. Red Olivia was dishonest and Walternate is out for revenge, Walter, whom has made many mistakes (which stealing Peter isn't -it's September's) has tried very hard to prove to his alternate son how much he loves him...and Olivia too has traveled across universes just to save his life. The love and redemtion they shown him, gives him more hope...and that through his hope, which he passes along to Red Olivia (Peter's words about believing in saving both universes/baby = wanting a hopeful future) has changed the outlook for her. She realizes that the blue characters are people too and attempts to stop Walternate from destroying the blue universe. Water brings fire down to dreams/hope/wisdom, and fire gives spirit/knowledge to Water.

The red univerdse can only be altered from the blue universe--

I believe that the red universe was the parent universe until sometime after the machine was taken through the black hole and created the blue...that at some point the blue found a way to interact with the parent at an earlier parallal period in the parent universe---this caused it to alter to "red", and this is why the entanglement exists and why the blue has to be the one to alter itself to alter the red...why we can't just directly change it's timeline. -we have to use the blue to change everything, because that is where the biggest probability for variation to be able to exist. (that is why future walter says you can't change the fact the machine came through and created the blue ad red in this manner--Peter's only option is change history from where he currently physically existed.

It's almost like the blue reality is a temporary timeline used to change the parent reality. (like adding on memory that can be resequenced, whcih then causes a ripple effect through the whole system backwards and forwrds)
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby real1 on Sat May 21, 2011 10:23 pm

Ok , recovered ! :glare:

Darth , sometimes you are blowing my mind more with your wonderful topics and posts :thumbup: ....

Actually , after reading the comments and the show runners and the actors , i still not satisfied .. that's why there is season4 :w00t: but ... the question is : what we do have from the past 3 seasons ? and what's the structure of the show ?

I wasn't watching Fringe from it's start , i have to admit that , i watch it before s3 started , and to simplify the things :

- Fringe is talking about 2 universes , there is a fabric between this 2 universes , blue and red , the blue side was knowing about the red side before the red knows.

-Walter bishop and William Bell are responsible of many things , hence , both are genius and intelligences , we don't know what they did in the past but they are working to protect the blue side from coming war between universes .

-Walter Bishop , crossed the line and stole his alternate son , red Peter , while blue Peter is dead , we are not sure if Walter keeps his body or not .

-William Bell , created a trails "cortexiphan" which was very successful on one strongest child ..Olivia Dunham .

-The machine , we don't know who did build the machine but we knew that future Walter did send it back through time hole to present , just to make red Peter do a different choice .

-We don't know why the machine is activated by the Altbishope DNA , I can't say red Peter's DNA , because we saw that they did take DNA of bompy boy ( which red Peter and AltOlivia have ) and separate the 23 DNA of his mother which will let 23 DNA of his Father Bishop to activate the machine .. which will suggest that the bloodline of bishops are connecting to make the machine active .

-We know that red Peter can drive the machine to make choices , but , he will need Olivia to switch it off .

-Crowbar , suggest that Olivia has a connecting to machine by her mind controlling , and can switch off the machine to let Peter in the machine or to let him out of it , also Peter can use the machine while Olivia was at his side and in front of him .

-The future did control the past and the present ( which is not clear how yet).

NOW , red Peter chose to open the door between the red and the blue by the bridge , and William Bell was afraid if the doorway between universes was ever opened only one universe will survive , which mean we are still at the war between universes ,

in the possible future we saw that red Peter did choose the blue side and ruined the red side , but the blue side was dieing , future Walter said that the 2 universes were linked if one dies the other will too , which is the opposite what William Bell did say ..... which mean .. the 2 sides should be there and they must work to restore the fabric between them ... OR maybe .. creating a third universe between the red and the blue ???

Red Peter did vanished from the vision after he did the bridge and while he was still talking about what to do , and no one remember him . according to the Observer he served his purpose , SO he never existed , .. the question is : he never existed in the blue history ? or he never existed from all the times ? .. i will go that he never existed at the blue side , but he is at the red side , because they can cheat the time but can't cheat the existence .. that's the logic thing .. but who's know what they will do ....

I re=watched "white tulips" , Peak was there in the history but no one in the present did remember what he did , and that's can go for Red Peter , that he is exist in the red side but no one in the blue side can remember him , but that will let red Peter the only one who has a memory for what did happen ?? i don't know ...

If they will choose to let red Peter ever existed in any times ...... then how that can be ? ... it's not logic ... but i guess we may see projection Peter in Olivia's mind ? I don't know ....

an other thing .. x-man which will kill Olivia .. is that mean he will success to kill present Olivia ? all over again killing Olivia in the present .. so even if red Peter is alive in the red side he will never could use the machine again because Olivia will die all over again and the worlds will end at this point .

Or the x-man who will try to kill Olivia but not success ? .. or by mistake he will kill AltOlivia instead of Olivia ?

Who's going to protect Olivia ? Nina ? Sam ? or maybe .. Walternate ?

So many things really , but i hope that the story is not around killing Olivia every time loop , because that's mean we are at the same circle every time .

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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Sun May 22, 2011 2:48 pm

real1 wrote:Ok , recovered ! :glare:

Darth , sometimes you are blowing my mind more with your wonderful topics and posts :thumbup: ....


Thanks! :)



real1 wrote:-Crowbar , suggest that Olivia has a connecting to machine by her mind controlling , and can switch off the machine to let Peter in the machine or to let him out of it , also Peter can use the machine while Olivia was at his side and in front of him .

-The future did control the past and the present ( which is not clear how yet).

NOW , red Peter chose to open the door between the red and the blue by the bridge , and William Bell was afraid if the doorway between universes was ever opened only one universe will survive , which mean we are still at the war between universes ,


in the possible future we saw that red Peter did choose the blue side and ruined the red side , but the blue side was dieing , future Walter said that the 2 universes were linked if one dies the other will too , which is the opposite what William Bell did say ..... which mean .. the 2 sides should be there and they must work to restore the fabric between them ... OR maybe .. creating a third universe between the red and the blue ???


You make two SUPER EXCELLENT points here! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: I never thought of these things! ---You're right Olivia, or Olivias might be able to crowbar the machine to get Peter "out". :thumbup:

And, yes, should we be concerned that William Bell feared this, and yet this is what the Observers want? I think so, considering in either case I am not sure whom more to trust, but between the Bell being shown with the McCutchen bottle (Parallels him to Lost's Charles Widmore) and the fact the Observers often go to blue Walter for help (they have faith in Walter), I am going to say that Bell is wrong in this instance and the Observers intentions are good, even if takes some time to prove to be so! :hmm:


Jeesh, can season 4 just start already?!?? :lol:
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby JacobsMom on Sun May 22, 2011 6:40 pm

DarthLocke wrote:But what about you guys? Peter, the machine, the Observers??? What do think is going to happen or be revealed about them in season 4? Or what would you like to see happen? :)


I've been thinking a little bit about Peter's "disappearing act". I agree that it may be very similar to what occurred with Peck. I think for Peter to be able to bridge these two universes together, he ended up changing the time lines that had previously been. When he did this, he basically erased himself from the events that happened before. Now there is no rift between Walternate and Walter or Olivia and Other Olivia because Peter never existed at all. I believe he didn't realize that this was going to occur but The Observers had known all along. Just as Peter being taken from the red universe by Walter was the cause of chaos, it was up to Peter to mend this by giving up his existence.

If the machine still does exist as season 4 begins, then I think we will see the introduction to all the info leading up to this creation. This may be where it becomes The Observer season and all that they stand for. Maybe there will be a way to reintroduce Peter into the story line either as a new character, or what I am hoping for, another reset of putting Peter right back into the time line that we have always been on. It would be as if he never left in the first place. :) He could accomplish what Peck couldn't and that is giving life a second chance.
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby real1 on Sun May 22, 2011 11:30 pm

DarthLocke wrote: You make two SUPER EXCELLENT points here! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: I never thought of these things! ---You're right Olivia, or Olivias might be able to crowbar the machine to get Peter "out". :thumbup:

And, yes, should we be concerned that William Bell feared this, and yet this is what the Observers want? I think so, considering in either case I am not sure whom more to trust, but between the Bell being shown with the McCutchen bottle (Parallels him to Lost's Charles Widmore) and the fact the Observers often go to blue Walter for help (they have faith in Walter), I am going to say that Bell is wrong in this instance and the Observers intentions are good, even if takes some time to prove to be so! :hmm:


Jeesh, can season 4 just start already?!?? :lol:


:sneaky: Nope AltOlivia has nothing to do with BBM ! ( you just teasing me about Altolivia :lol: ), Walternate said to her you can switch off the machine the drawing suggests that and she told him i don't understand what you want me to do , and then clearly Olivia went up to the machine and the machine did switch off .

Hence , that the crowbar has Olivia's pic not Altolivia , the bang up not down , hence that Olivia did switch off the protection that the machine was doing it , which mean .. the BBM was acting as if red Peter was in it , so who can switch it off and open the machine ? it was Olivia .. so ... no .. no and no i disagree ... Altolivia has nothing .. nothing to do with that .

i agree that the observers were maybe trying to protect both sides ... and that they are waiting to see the bridge the doorway between universes to be opened , but I will go with William Bell suggestion .. that the doorway must ever be opened because it will lead to ruin one universe . which mean there must be another way to restore balance which Olivia was thinking of .

Yes .. I want s4 right now :) ...... but i hope that our mains character are not going to change toooo much .. at least keep Olivia as Olivia ... am not counting on the other side to do any thing , Walternat maybe will act as if he want to restore balance but inside he wants only his universe to survive , and maybe .. maybe walternate is not losing his memory ... and knows that Olivia has something to do with BBM so he will try to brainwashing her all over again to make her think that she is from the other side and should protect her universe ... or maybe he will be responsible and behind x-man which will try to kill her all over again . I don't know

:cool:
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Mon May 23, 2011 2:24 am

real1 wrote:
DarthLocke wrote: You make two SUPER EXCELLENT points here! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: I never thought of these things! ---You're right Olivia, or Olivias might be able to crowbar the machine to get Peter "out". :thumbup:

And, yes, should we be concerned that William Bell feared this, and yet this is what the Observers want? I think so, considering in either case I am not sure whom more to trust, but between the Bell being shown with the McCutchen bottle (Parallels him to Lost's Charles Widmore) and the fact the Observers often go to blue Walter for help (they have faith in Walter), I am going to say that Bell is wrong in this instance and the Observers intentions are good, even if takes some time to prove to be so! :hmm:


Jeesh, can season 4 just start already?!?? :lol:


:sneaky: Nope AltOlivia has nothing to do with BBM ! ( you just teasing me about Altolivia :lol: ), Walternate said to her you can switch off the machine the drawing suggests that and she told him i don't understand what you want me to do , and then clearly Olivia went up to the machine and the machine did switch off .

Hence , that the crowbar has Olivia's pic not Altolivia , the bang up not down , hence that Olivia did switch off the protection that the machine was doing it , which mean .. the BBM was acting as if red Peter was in it , so who can switch it off and open the machine ? it was Olivia .. so ... no .. no and no i disagree ... Altolivia has nothing .. nothing to do with that .

i agree that the observers were maybe trying to protect both sides ... and that they are waiting to see the bridge the doorway between universes to be opened , but I will go with William Bell suggestion .. that the doorway must ever be opened because it will lead to ruin one universe . which mean there must be another way to restore balance which Olivia was thinking of .

Yes .. I want s4 right now :) ...... but i hope that our mains character are not going to change toooo much .. at least keep Olivia as Olivia ... am not counting on the other side to do any thing , Walternat maybe will act as if he want to restore balance but inside he wants only his universe to survive , and maybe .. maybe walternate is not losing his memory ... and knows that Olivia has something to do with BBM so he will try to brainwashing her all over again to make her think that she is from the other side and should protect her universe ... or maybe he will be responsible and behind x-man which will try to kill her all over again . I don't know

:cool:

I originally agreed with you about only the blue Olivia being the crowbar, which could still be the case... however, in those final sequences leading to Peter's bridge and disappearance, Brandonate and Walternate discovered their stolen piece of tech (from episode "The Box") is also an additional failsafe key with yet another copy of the same parchment that Sam and Olivia steal from the museum...so it is suspicious that there are two Olivias and 2 failsafe keys...but the whole sequence and alteration in itself may prove that part irrelevant... :unsure:

It will surely be interesting to see how their new memories will either eliminate earlier problems, or just manifest in a different way, or create complete new ones! :)
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby real1 on Mon May 23, 2011 3:26 am

Brandonate and Walternate discovered their stolen piece of tech (from episode "The Box") is also an additional failsafe key with yet another copy of the same parchment that Sam and Olivia steal from the museum...so it is suspicious that there are two Olivias and 2 failsafe keys...but the whole sequence and alteration in itself may prove that part irrelevant... :unsure:


:hmm: ... I don't think there was 2 crowbar , it's only one crowbar , but i do think that someone did transfer the copy of the crowbar to Walternate in order to protect Olivia from him by making him thinking that Altolivia has something with BBM , while in fact ... she has nothing , it was Olivia all a round . which let me thinking that Sam Weiss is the protector of Olivia somehow :

Sam : said to Nina that to not be sure from Peter , that he maybe will choose AltOlivia . and this case .. we will doubt Nina all over again .

Sam : sent a copy of the crowbar to Walternate , in order to protect Olivia from killing her if he will discover that she is the one protector for all the universes .

So , there is a story to tell i think for that ........ Maybe Olivia is from another planet or something ? Sam and the observers are protecting her to a right time ...... that she must be hiding in blue universe .. and keeping AltOlivia alive to protect Olivia ? ..... but .. what about red Peter in this case ? .. why would Olivia be connected to red Peter ? I mean by connected .. that there is something like a magnets between both of them .. Olivia can effect red Peter and red Peter can effect Olivia ..... maybe it's the destiny after all .

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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby DarthLocke on Mon May 23, 2011 3:15 pm

real1 wrote:
Brandonate and Walternate discovered their stolen piece of tech (from episode "The Box") is also an additional failsafe key with yet another copy of the same parchment that Sam and Olivia steal from the museum...so it is suspicious that there are two Olivias and 2 failsafe keys...but the whole sequence and alteration in itself may prove that part irrelevant... :unsure:


:hmm: ... I don't think there was 2 crowbar , it's only one crowbar , but i do think that someone did transfer the copy of the crowbar to Walternate in order to protect Olivia from him by making him thinking that Altolivia has something with BBM , while in fact ... she has nothing , it was Olivia all a round . which let me thinking that Sam Weiss is the protector of Olivia somehow :

Sam : said to Nina that to not be sure from Peter , that he maybe will choose AltOlivia . and this case .. we will doubt Nina all over again .

Sam : sent a copy of the crowbar to Walternate , in order to protect Olivia from killing her if he will discover that she is the one protector for all the universes .

So , there is a story to tell i think for that ........ Maybe Olivia is from another planet or something ? Sam and the observers are protecting her to a right time ...... that she must be hiding in blue universe .. and keeping AltOlivia alive to protect Olivia ? ..... but .. what about red Peter in this case ? .. why would Olivia be connected to red Peter ? I mean by connected .. that there is something like a magnets between both of them .. Olivia can effect red Peter and red Peter can effect Olivia ..... maybe it's the destiny after all .

:cool:



We don't know why/how red Olivia knew where to look for the box (subway station), but her box she stole and was able to send back overthere is identical to the one Sam went to retrieve in the museum. So there are two boxes which both are found in the blue universe....my guess is that this is also a buy product of previous alterations via the machine... or it might be making up for the original course by having 2 failasafes since their are two Olivias and two machines...---We still don't know why William Bell helped Walternate make a duplicate machine, because the red universe gave no proof to unearthing theirs...so it appears as a fresh copy of the machine....but if their are other alterations, then perhaps they figured out that two machines are better than one, because then they can use them together in a new way?!
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Re: Season 4! Call it!

Postby real1 on Mon May 23, 2011 9:44 pm

:hmm:

Ok back to S2 , Walternate had pic of Peter , and we have another pic which the observer gave it to Olivia . and then we have a pic of Olivia on another pic linked with Peter "last Sam Weiss" .

IF .. If the nonesense had her pic on the drawing .. then why the bang was up not down ?

In "Entrada" we saw the piece which AltOlivia stole , there was no box there , just a piece without any thing and it was the power supply of the machine according to Peter .

If Walternat was knowing that AltOlivia has any thing to do with the machine .. all that time .. i think he will start on her many tests .. and she was at libery island cuz she was trying to cross over and Walternate puts her in the jail there .. so it was happen that Altolivia was there ... and really it's no meaning and will make none sense if they will say AltOlivia has any thing with BBm ... because it's definitely only Olivia .

I hope they will stuck with that ! .. .. changing the story line now is very riski!! imo and we have only one hero for Fringe = Olivia . the end .

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